The books > Genders of the animals

Discuss Lewis Carroll's books "Alice's Adventures in Wonderland" and "Through the Looking Glass" here!
austrian Mad Hatter

Genders of the animals

Postby austrian Mad Hatter » Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:02 pm

The Mock Turtle was always female in my imagination.
Maybe the Cheshire Cat could be also female...
The Dormouse is male. Also the White Rabbit and the Caterpillar. The mouse in the pool of tears maybe also male.
What do you think?

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germanyMad-Hatter
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Postby germanyMad-Hatter » Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:09 pm

I think it's the same what sex the charakter have.
And I think the Rabbit is male and the rest also.
But the grinning cat is a female!


AIW(:-* germanyMad-Hatter
Last edited by germanyMad-Hatter on Tue Jul 14, 2009 4:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Notgoodatenglish

Postby Notgoodatenglish » Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:34 pm

I think it's the same waht sex the charakter have.
And I think the Rabbit is male and the rest also.
But the grinning cat is a female!


AIW(:-* germanyMad-Hatter
That's only because you are a fan of the 1999 tv made version with Tina Majorino, where you saw Whoopi Goldberg as Cheshire Cat, is'nt it?!DIS:-S I like this adaption also very much, I love Miranda Richardson as Queen of Hearts and Martin Short as Mad Hatter is amazing!!! :D The director of the film, Nick Willing make now a new tv miniseries called "Alice", but it's a modernised fantasy adaption for grown-ups in the style of his "Tin Man"... But he says as he was making the NBC version that he like Lewis Carroll's sence for humour, this victorian british "nonsens", so maybe this miniseries is also influenced by that...
(The producers are the same, Robert Halmi Jr. and Sr., for RHI Entertainment, formely known as "Hallmark Entertainment"...)

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ait_meijin
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Postby ait_meijin » Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:45 pm

The Dormouse in Russian translation is only female, it's hard to translate otherwise. Just FYI :-)

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The Queen of Hearts
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Postby The Queen of Hearts » Tue Jul 14, 2009 7:19 pm

In the Spanish version I read the Mock Turtle was female. I think that it was a matter of being lost in translation since the Spanish word for turtle is "tortuga", which is femine so they used "ella" (the word for "she"), although since I'm not a native or very fluent Spanish speaker I could be wrong. It really bothered me for some reason.

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Postby QueenAlice » Sat Jul 18, 2009 10:19 am

In my opinion, the Cheshire Cat is a male.

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ilovecheshirecat
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Postby ilovecheshirecat » Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:08 pm

In my opinion, the Cheshire Cat is a male.
Yes, I am pretty sure the Cheshire Cat is a male.

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We'reAllMadHere
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Postby We'reAllMadHere » Sun Oct 11, 2009 10:38 am

Yeah, I always thought the Cat to be male. But seeing as all the other creatures are referred to mostly as "it" rather than "he" or "she" their gender could be debatable. I always used to wonder why it was that there were never many female characters in the Alice books, why a lot of the characters seem male. But, then again, maybe because I'm a boy I imagine the "it" characters to be male.

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Postby Beautiful Soup » Mon Oct 19, 2009 4:12 am

I've been wondering about this ever since I saw this thread

I notice that the Cheshire Cat and the Dormouse are both exclusively referred to as 'it', but the March Hare is described as 'him'

The Caterpillar is also described as 'it', but it doesn't complain or correct Alice when she addresses it as 'sir'

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NeVaR aSk
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Postby NeVaR aSk » Mon Oct 19, 2009 1:37 pm

^ the Dormouse is male... referred as "him/his" in chapter 11.

`Collar that Dormouse,' the Queen shrieked out. `Behead that Dormouse! Turn that Dormouse out of court! Suppress him! Pinch him! Off with his whiskers!'


[EDIT]

The Cheshire Cat is male! :p (well at least is refered as "his" in chapter 8)

`Well, it must be removed,' said the King very decidedly, and he called the Queen, who was passing at the moment, `My dear! I wish you would have this cat removed!'

The Queen had only one way of settling all difficulties, great or small. `Off with his head!' she said, without even looking round.

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Postby Evertype » Thu Nov 05, 2009 9:49 pm

In my opinion, the Cheshire Cat is a male.
Anna Matlack Richards, in her 1895 tale A New Alice in the Old Wonderland (to be re-published next month by Evertype), definitely has the Cheshire-Cat as female, nursing her kittens.

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Postby Beautiful Soup » Sun Nov 08, 2009 4:35 am

Well spotted Nevar Ask!

(I always forget that some of the characters reappear in the trial scene.)

I've been thinking that the animals aren't described as 'it' because they lack a gender, but because they lack humanity. The 'it-ness' of them reflects their status, not their sex. Hence, the Caterpillar is referred to as it, despite the fact that it's male.

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Re: Genders of the animals

Postby Beautiful Soup » Sun Nov 08, 2009 4:42 am

The Mock Turtle was always female in my imagination.
Maybe the Cheshire Cat could be also female...
The Dormouse is male. Also the White Rabbit and the Caterpillar. The mouse in the pool of tears maybe also male.
What do you think?
The Mock turtle is referred to as male,

"They had not gone far before they saw the Mock Turtle in the distance, sitting sad and lonely on a little ledge of rock, and, as they came nearer, Alice could hear him sighing as if his heart would break. She pitied him deeply. `What is his sorrow?' she asked the Gryphon, and the Gryphon answered, very nearly in the same words as before, `It's all his fancy, that: he hasn't got no sorrow, you know. Come on!'"

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NeVaR aSk
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Postby NeVaR aSk » Sun Nov 08, 2009 1:40 pm

^ Well my friend, I'm non-english speaker so correct me if I'm wrong :p ... but I think 'It' can be used on animals/pets.

uhm DIS:-S

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Postby The Queen of Hearts » Sun Nov 08, 2009 5:52 pm

^ Well my friend, I'm non-english speaker so correct me if I'm wrong :p ... but I think 'It' can be used on animals/pets.

uhm DIS:-S
Often times yes, although alot of people feel that pets shouldn't be called "it" since they're like a member of the family. I think alot depends on personal preference for this one.


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